Madam Speaker: Prior to Oral Questions, I would like to draw the attention of all honourable members to the public gallery where we have this afternoon fifty-five Grade 9 students from Minnetonka School under the direction of Mrs. Madeline McKenzie. This school is located in the constituency of the honourable member for Seine River (Mrs. Dacquay).
We also have thirty-one Grade 11 students from Fisher Branch Collegiate under the direction of Mr. Cliff Skibinski. This school is located in the constituency of the honourable member for Interlake (Mr. Clif Evans).
On behalf of all honourable members, I welcome you this afternoon.
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Funding
Mr. Gary Doer (Leader of the Opposition): Madam Speaker, in February of 1995 the federal government produced a budget that we all condemned for the federal cuts in health and post-secondary education.
On March 17, 1995, the former Minister of Health in announcing the capital plans for the province of Manitoba stated, and I quote: we have a recipe for a sustainable health care system in light of the massive federal cuts here in the province of Manitoba.
On March 23, the Premier of this province in the election campaign promised $600 million in capital for health care and said that this capital and these capital projects would go ahead in spite of the federal cuts that were made to the province of Manitoba.
Would the Premier now admit the truth in this House, that the crisis in health care is a direct result of his broken election promise and no other reason in terms of what is going on in terms of health care?
Hon. Gary Filmon (Premier): Madam Speaker, the fact of the matter is that health care is, firstly, not only the most prized area of public service in Canada today on any survey, on any poll that is done, on any questioning, but, secondly, it is also the most costly. When it was introduced, it was intended to be a 50-50 cost share between the federal government and the provinces, and it has now deteriorated as a result of successive decisions made by governments right across the board, federal governments saying that they were no longer a 50-50 partner, and of course most recently we have had massive reductions in our health care funding from Ottawa to the point that today Ottawa pays on a cash basis just over 15 percent of the costs in Manitoba. Even if you include the transfer of tax points that was done way back in the '70s, it accounts for less than a third of our costs.
That deterioration has been recognized by people from all provinces in Canada, that deterioration of federal support. It has been recognized by members of the New Democratic Party in Ottawa, Madam Speaker, and I might say most recently very strongly spoken to by Judy Wasylycia-Leis, the former Deputy Leader of this party, this New Democratic Party in this Legislature during that period of time, and she said, I might say, federal NDP Health critic Judy Wasylycia-Leis lays the blame squarely on the federal government for cutting billions out of provincial funding for health care. In the House of Commons yesterday the Winnipeg North Centre M.P. went so far as to charge that Health minister, Allan Rock, now has blood on his hands. She said, and I quote: Those massive cuts have had a ripple effect across the country and put stress on all provincial governments.
Madam Speaker, that is the issue that we are dealing with. That is what we have been attempting to do, and we have put more money in year upon year upon year. In the decade that we have been in office we have increased our funding to health care $600 million, and so the member opposite ought to listen and consult with his federal counterparts who know the truth of the circumstances that we face.
Mr. Doer: Madam Speaker, I suggest Manitobans should not listen to this Premier who broke his election promise of 1995 after the federal budget was released some one month before, and that is the real issue: his broken promise and the crisis over a period of time where the Fiscal Stabilization Fund has grown to close to $600 million; we have a crisis in our health care system.
Madam Speaker, I would like to table a letter from Dr. Chochinov from the emergency department of St. Boniface Hospital and he says, " . . . our status as an accredited teaching hospital is now in jeopardy, as a direct consequence of the overcrowding in the Emergency hallways with admitted medical patients."
I would like to ask the Premier, will he take responsibility of his nine years of health care neglect and broken promises in terms of the results of a hospital, a proud hospital having their status as an accredited hospital at risk because of his direct action?
Hon. Darren Praznik (Minister of Health): Madam Speaker, as the Premier (Mr. Filmon) has indicated, we as a provincial government have continued to put more and more resources into health care each year. We have done that despite having very significant reductions in our support from the national government, and we have never denied that we have run this system at its, in many cases, maximum capacity. We have had to, given those reductions from Ottawa. By the way, we have made those up, but the demands on the system grow well above the rate of inflation and we, like all provinces, have found it very difficult to keep up at that rate without support of the national government.
With respect specifically to the emergency service in Winnipeg and St. Boniface, we invested additional dollars last fall and have now built them into the budget for an agreement with our emergency doctors, there to ensure that that piece was in place and operating. One should not forget that we almost had a strike last fall in our emergency service, and we put additional dollars into emergency physicians to guarantee service.
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Mr. Doer: Madam Speaker, three years ago this government promised, in spite of the federal cuts, $600 million in capital, and after the election campaign they cancelled the capital. The crisis is due to this Premier's (Mr. Filmon) broken promise, solely and directly, no other place.
The St. Boniface Hospital letter goes on to say that our own infectious disease staff have cautioned us to the risks of housing patients under crowded substandard conditions, given the increasing prevalence of serious infectious disease. Will this Premier take responsibility for his broken election promise and take responsibility through his two Ministers of Health and their changing words to the people of Manitoba and deal with the crisis and deal with the people in hallways that are at risk for infectious disease and take leadership on this issue, rather than just pointing the finger somewhere else after he breaks his promise?
Mr. Praznik: Madam Speaker, there are many factors that enter into assessing health care budgets, in terms of increased demand that are difficult to assess, given during the year. That is why, during the course of last year, we went back to Treasury Board to add additional dollars into the system on an interim basis, which we have now built into our base to meet those particular needs.
There is no doubt, no one has denied that we have been pushing our system to the maximum. We have had to. Like every other provincial government in this country, we have had to do those things. Have we liked them? Not at all. Do we wish we could have been in the ground earlier? Absolutely. It is a matter of balancing the resources one has available to them, and as federal resources decline and as other needs in the health care system increase, home care, Pharmacare over those years, one has to make decisions on an interim basis.
But a major point that has to be made here is, as our fiscal situations improve, we are investing without the national government in additional beds that will ease some of that pressure in our system.
Funding
Mr. Dave Chomiak (Kildonan): C'est triste que ni le ministre de la Santé ni le Premier ministre du Manitoba n'a accepté la responsabilité pour la crise dans l'hôpital et aussi ils sont en train de dire que le gouvernement fédéral est seulement responsable pour la crise.
[Translation]
It is unfortunate that neither the Health minister nor the First Minister (Mr. Filmon) has accepted responsibility for the crisis in the hospital and they continue to say that the federal government alone is responsible for the crisis.
[English]
But, Madam Speaker, this letter today from the St. Boniface Hospital is unprecedented, where the head of emergency is saying to this government, and I will quote again for the minister: " . . . our status as an accredited teaching hospital is now in jeopardy, as a direct consequence of the overcrowding of the Emergency hallways." Further, this problem has been existing for a number of years. The minister's and the Premier's answers are totally unacceptable to Manitobans.
When will they begin to do something about this crisis, which is the result of their cutting of their capital budget?
Hon. Darren Praznik (Minister of Health): Madam Speaker, the member for Kildonan, the Leader of the Opposition (Mr. Doer), I am not quite sure in what world of government they are coming from. How could one not be involved in public affairs in this country over the last number of years and not appreciate the vast amount of money that a national government, that has pledged to a national health care system, has pulled out of that system while all our areas of costs have been increasing? The former member for St. Johns, the former deputy to the current Leader of the Opposition, acknowledged that very clearly after the federal budget. That is not to say that all blame is there, but surely to goodness any reasonable Manitoban looking at this, hearing what members opposite have to say have to recognize that you cannot pull over $200 million out of the health care system in this province annually and expect that that is going to be made up and everything is going to be as it used to be without that money. That is just impossible. Manitobans understand that.
Mr. Chomiak: Madam Speaker, will the Minister of Health, who found $34 million for the SmartHealth computer system or perhaps $55 million for the Lotteries Commission to renovate casinos, not accept and not review what this letter states, which is that the only option that is being offered by St. Boniface Hospital in order to deal with the crisis is closing the emergency ward, not at present levels but prior to even exceeding the present levels because it is so acute? They are so worried about infections; there are so many difficulties. The only option is going to be regular closing of the emergency ward at St. Boniface Hospital.
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Mr. Praznik: Madam Speaker, the members opposite have to at least acknowledge that when you pull that amount of money out of a health care system, it is going to put pressure on that system. Their own former member makes the point in Ottawa and fights the battle for national medicare and proper support. It is regrettable that we do not have members opposite as allies in that battle. It is that kind of argument, that kind of lack of recognition that leads the Prime Minister of this country to not even appreciate what in fact those policies have done to the health care systems across this country.
This letter the member brings to my attention, it was addressed to the chief executive officer of St. Boniface Hospital. Obviously, the St. Boniface Hospital will want to discuss what immediate steps can be taken to deal with some of the pressure with the Winnipeg Hospital Authority, and we will support those efforts.
Mr. Chomiak: Madam Speaker, will the minister, in reviewing this situation and whenever he starts to review this situation, not consider the fact that his much-ballyhooed Winnipeg Hospital Authority, which has hired 60 executives, has suggested in this letter the solution to the infectious disease problem, the solution to the problem is no solution? They have ordered them not to close the emergency ward, and that is their solution. No resources, no assistance, no advice, hiring of executives, and the crisis continues not just at St. Boniface but at Grace, Seven Oaks, Health Sciences Centre and throughout the city and province.
Mr. Praznik: Madam Speaker, health care is a very serious topic, and the people of Manitoba who depend on our health care system I think deserve to have a fair argument on the facts. It is absolutely critical I think in the debates in which we engage that we be accurate in our facts.
Madam Speaker, we have not denied that our health care system has been run, in many cases, at certain times of the year certainly to its maximum capacity. We have not denied that at all. We have been trying to manage, we have put more resources, taking them out of other departments and directing them into health care, as we have been able to. We have done all of that while we have had significant reductions in our support from the national government, a government that still prances around the country trying to be the saviours of medicare and are not there, and are aided and abetted by oppositions like the one opposite who totally deny that it is a problem.
The member for Kildonan comes to this House with information about administrators that is not accurate--
An Honourable Member: It is in the letter.
Mr. Praznik: Well, the numbers that he puts to this House are not accurate, and the image he attempts to portray is not.
Physician Resources--Pediatrics
Mr. Leonard Evans (Brandon East): Madam Speaker, I have a question for the Minister of Health. As the Minister of Health should well know, there is a serious shortage of pediatricians at the Brandon General Hospital. This has been demonstrated in a recent letter addressed to the minister--and I will table a copy for the House--from a young mother in Rivers whose 10-month-old baby suffered a seizure. She rushed into the Brandon General Hospital to find that there were no pediatric services available on that day. Luckily, they happened to find a pediatrician who was there for a different purpose, and that was by sheer luck.
So the Minister of Health has known for some time that BGH has not been able to obtain pediatricians. Now I ask the minister: will the Minister of Health now consult with the Minister of Finance (Mr. Stefanson) who said yesterday: if there is a need in our hospital system we will meet that need, and we will provide the resources when required at that particular point in time.
The minister has known about this for some time. I now ask him: will he now consult with the Minister of Finance and get the money--
Madam Speaker: Order, please. The question has been put.
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Hon. Darren Praznik (Minister of Health): Madam Speaker, I am aware of the situation in Brandon. In fact, we have spoken to the CEO of the authority about it on a number of occasions. My office has been speaking with him about that. The issue there I do not believe necessarily is one of money; it is one of recruitment. There is a dispute between the regional health authority and the two physicians about the models for how one would pay. I understand the regional health authority did offer contract positions. Those were not acceptable. There are issues of on-call fees and fee for service that have province-wide implications that should be settled at a bargaining table with the MMA, the Manitoba Medical Association, that we hope to be entering into very, very shortly, but there is an issue of recruitment, and there is an issue of finding additional specialists in that particular field. Like the Brandon Health Authority, we are attempting to recruit physicians for those positions.
Mr. Leonard Evans: Madam Speaker, I want to ask the minister how he really expects to resolve this crisis, which is this serious problem which has been going on for some months, and answer the young woman who says that she fears for her son's safety if she had to face that situation again. How are you going to answer this young woman and others in that area who need these services, depend upon them, and a minister and a government who for months and months flounders around not coming to grips with a solution which I am sorry to say really does boil down to having sufficient funds to properly fund that health care system in Brandon?
Mr. Praznik: Madam Speaker, I take it what the member for Brandon East is saying is that any amount of money should be paid to anybody who is prepared to come, that there should not be a proper negotiation, that fees or methods of remuneration should not be consistent across the province or be negotiated, but one should just offer whatever someone asks. That is in fact how we got into a great disparity of the manner in which emergency physicians were paid, that individual hospitals all across the province did their own deals. That fell apart.
The member implies that nothing has been done to recruit physicians. I can tell the member that through the efforts of my legislative assistant, the member for Turtle Mountain (Mr. Tweed), we embarked on a recruitment plan that had over 50 foreign doctors apply to have their credentials checked. They are being matched and being worked through the system. I have been signing their conditional registries over the last number of weeks, and the one slow part to this process has been working through the Immigration department of the federal government. So there has been a greater effort at recruiting physicians in the last while, and it has reaped great success. I hope we are going to be able to fill those slots in Brandon.
Hon. Glen Findlay (Minister of Highways and Transportation): Madam Speaker, I do not have the precise numbers in front of me, to the member for St. Boniface, but we have in previous Highways budgets committed a few million towards the project of twinning Highway 59 south of the floodway where the bridge was opened last fall. It is carrying traffic now down to the north junction of 330 and further work continues at a rapid pace, but the member must also realize that because of the flooding last spring, the new lanes of Highway 59 are to be considered for future flood protection for the area, so there is a combined flood protection-highway building project that is being worked on. We are committed with many millions over the course of the next period of time to be sure that we have safe travelling for people coming up and down Highway 59 south.
Mr. Gaudry: I thank the minister for his answer. Since we had a bad accident again on Highway 59, when can we expect that the twinning will be done to Ile des Chenes?
Mr. Findlay: Madam Speaker, the total cost to get to Ile des Chenes is some $60 million. As I said, we have the northern portion with a bridge over the floodway now built, and we aggressively work as fast as we can, to the member opposite, within all the restrictions that exist. Acquiring land is a particular challenge in that area; it is not easy. We are committed, as fast as we can, to get that road four-laned in the length that the member talks--14 kilometres, $60 million.
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Mr. Neil Gaudry (St. Boniface): My question to the same minister: given that the Minister of Finance (Mr. Stefanson) announced $7.1 million in infrastructure, what has been allocated for the roads in northern Manitoba?
Hon. Glen Findlay (Minister of Highways and Transportation): Madam Speaker, we will have at our disposal $105 million of capital for highways in Manitoba in this particular budget. We normally have a two-year program out in front of the industry which will be announced in due course. It will have projects for all over the province. The general rule of thumb we have used in northern Manitoba is, it is 11 percent of the highway network up there, and we will have at least 11 percent of the budget for highways across all of Manitoba dedicated to northern Manitoba.
Funding--Property Taxes
Ms. Jean Friesen (Wolseley): Madam Speaker, after years of cuts in education funding, this year the minister announced a much-needed increase at about the level of inflation, and at the same time her government's budget has been attempting to lead Manitobans to expect that they would individually have some tax breaks, but in fact the very opposite is the case. Brandon residents are looking at a huge school tax of 13.9 percent; some Transcona residents are facing a hike of 6 percent; Beautiful Plains School Division and Garden Valley School Division are both of them anticipating an 11 percent increase, and the list goes on.
I would like to ask the Minister of Education to explain to the House why she and her government are attempting to deliberately avoid any responsibility for the widespread tax increases that Manitobans are facing.
Hon. Linda McIntosh (Minister of Education and Training): Madam Speaker, the funding for education, as you know, flows through a formula, a formula that was put together very much needed and very much requested by the field because the formula that had been in place in the 1980s was no longer working. That formula was put together with input from the field. People on the committee that helped devise it included the then superintendent of the Brandon School Division. The members of the Brandon School Board have made it very clear to me that they have no objection to the funding formula. That is not a problem. They have been in to see me, and they wanted to make it clear because they felt that it was in the paper being portrayed as if perhaps they did not approve of the funding formula. They do. Their problem this year--and some other divisions, not all, some divisions had a problem with reassessment. When you can talk about percentages, the dollar amounts reveal that in Brandon, on an average home, they would be facing about an $80 increase, having received 11.1 percent increase in funding from this province over the previous five or six years. So they did fare very, very well in the years leading up to this year.
Ms. Jean Friesen (Wolseley): Could the minister explain why, last year, she promised school divisions they could count on at least a zero percent funding for this year when the real story is in fact that over half of Manitoba school divisions are going to find themselves with far less than that zero percent?
Hon. Linda McIntosh (Minister of Education and Training): Madam Speaker, last year what school divisions were told, and it was very clear, it was very clear indeed both in writing and in verbal communications, was that the overall amount provided to education would be no fewer dollars than the overall amount provided the year before, and indeed that is true. We also made it clear at the time that, of course, individual school divisions would find their amounts would be increased or decreased depending upon various factors in their particular school division.
In the case of Brandon, for example, their student enrollment went down, hence the funding went down, and that would happen the reverse--if their enrollment had gone up, their funding would go up. In fact, if their projections are wrong at the end of September, the $200,000 they are losing because of decreased enrollment, if those students actually do show up in school, the $200,000 would automatically flow to them as an adjustment at the end of September.
So it was very clear to divisions, it was the overall amount in the government funding and they knew that, and they acknowledged that.
Funding--Information Release
Mr. Tim Sale (Crescentwood): Madam Speaker, this Finance minister has been criticized twice by the Ombudsman for withholding information vital to Manitobans' interests, the Winnipeg Jets issue, the poll that he commissioned for his prebudget. Now there is the question of his withholding unreasonably the special warrant which was dated February 18 but not released until this Monday.
Why does the minister continue to withhold and hide vital information from Manitobans who have a right to know what the changes in their spending plans have been?
Hon. Eric Stefanson (Minister of Finance): Madam Speaker, the special warrant that the member for Crescentwood refers to had been available since February 27, the day that I released the Third Quarter Report. I am sure if he took the time to read the Third Quarter Report, on page 2 he would see very specific reference to the special warrant, that the expenditure forecasts include all of the expenditure requirements which were recently approved by the special warrant.
So it has been available since February 27. It was circulated as part of the regular process of how it is distributed weekly to all of the various offices.
Mr. Sale: Madam Speaker, perhaps the minister could explain to us then why that special warrant was not distributed on the date that he mentions but in fact was in the package of things that came out only after his budget had been delivered. Perhaps he might also explain why the information in the warrant is different from the information in the third quarter statement.
Mr. Stefanson: Madam Speaker, the distribution of the Orders-in-Council followed the exact same process they always have. They go out once a week. This particular one was included with the batch that was available on Friday and distributed, I gather, not on Friday but on Monday. It has clearly been available. It has been available since the 27th of February. It was referred to in the Third Quarter Report, and certainly if the members opposite were doing any of their own homework, they would have recognized that it was available and is referred to very specifically in the Third Quarter Report.
In terms of the issue of differences between special warrants and ultimate expenditures, I would encourage the member for Crescentwood to talk to some of his colleagues who have had the opportunity to be in government in previous years, because what you have to do is you have to allocate--you cannot move money between accounts. You cannot use lapses in one account and just transfer it to another account. You have to actually allocate the resources within the individual program. So it is not uncommon that you will have a special warrant expenditure which is significantly higher than your net expenditures are because of lapsing in other areas.
I am sure the Leader of the Opposition (Mr. Doer) understands that. I am sure the member for Brandon East (Mr. Leonard Evans) understands that. Please take the time and explain that to the member for Crescentwood.
Mr. Sale: Madam Speaker, the minister did not answer the question.
Why is the information on planned health spending different in the special warrant than it is in the third quarter statement? Why is the information on flood spending different in the third quarter statement than it is in the warrant? Why is the planning different?
Mr. Stefanson: This is absolutely unbelievable. The member should listen. I just explained that to him very thoroughly. You cannot take lapses in one line of the budget and transfer that to another account. When you have to provide money in an account, you have to provide all of that money. So, if he goes back and looks at special warrants, under our government, under the previous NDP government, he will see exactly the same treatment of special warrants, because you provide the amount that is required in the individual line and you do not transfer lapses from other accounts to those accounts, so it is normal that you will see a special warrant being higher than what is ultimately required because, in some accounts, you do not spend everything that is budgeted. I know the Leader of the Opposition (Mr. Doer) understands that process. I am sure the member for Brandon East (Mr. Leonard Evans) does. I wish they would take the time to enlighten one of their colleagues who so badly needs some enlightening.
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Information Pamphlets
Ms. Diane McGifford (Osborne): Madam Speaker, earlier this week the member for St. Vital (Mrs. Render) spoke of the government-sponsored IWD celebration with its themes of wellness, health and vitality. One of the pamphlets distributed at this event instructs women to make time for their husbands and offers this advice: Ask him for a date and hope he does not think you are too forward. Write an "I like you because" note to your husband. Watch for the right cartoon in the newspaper that reminds you of him. Tape it to his pillow.
I would like to ask the minister to explain how asking your husband for a date or pinning a note to his pillow promotes the status of Manitoba women, or is this take-your-shoes-off-get-to-the-kitchen-and-bake-him-a-pie mentality simply a reflection of this government's slack attitude towards women?
Hon. Rosemary Vodrey (Minister responsible for the Status of Women): Madam Speaker, we were very pleased to celebrate International Women's Day in the Legislature last Thursday, and at that celebration we focused on an issue very important to women in Manitoba, and that is women's wellness and wellness achieved through recreation, through fitness. On that day we were very pleased in fact to have the partnership of many groups in Manitoba and many departments of government which provided information, provided pamphlets and information to women and to families to assist them.
The member highlights information in that pamphlet distributed on that day which in fact in many cases and to many families may be something very important within their relationship. I would in fact also ask why she would not highlight other very important information which was given, such as nutritional information to assist families, information given to families giving information that the cost of a well-balanced meal does not in fact have to cost a lot of money.
Ms. McGifford: Madam Speaker, I would like to remind the minister that--
Madam Speaker: Order, please. The honourable member was recognized for a supplementary question. Please pose your question.
Ms. McGifford: Madam Speaker, the past two years have shown that this minister resents International Women's Day with its labour roots, but this is really no excuse for the kind of material that has been handed out. I would like to ask the minister to show the women of Manitoba a little respect, commit to take International Women's Day seriously, to do some serious work and scrutiny or simply do not bother.
Mrs. Vodrey: Madam Speaker, first of all, I can say what I do resent highly is the member's very personal remark about my commitment and the commitment of this government to the women of this province. I can tell you that, first of all, on International Women's Day we have highlighted issues which are very important to the lives of women in our province. Women in this province do have very important issues, issues of their own personal health in a diagnostic way, issues of their economic security, issues of their personal safety. In order to deal with those very serious issues, when a woman acts in this province as a cornerstone in family life, in the economic life of this province, she also has to be well.
So, Madam Speaker, on a positive note, this year this government decided to focus on women's wellness and their ability to feel well to deal with all the very important issues in their lives. The fact that the member has totally missed the point and is instead wanting to focus only on despair is shameful.
Head Tax
Mr. Conrad Santos (Broadway): Madam Speaker, to the same Minister of Culture, Heritage and Citizenship: If there is an immigration requirement which is based on things possessed rather than the personal qualities of prospective immigrants, is the poll head tax, which is almost exclusionary from immigrants coming from poor Third World countries, my question to the honourable minister is this: what effort has she done in dealing with the federal government so that the federal government will drop from their budget this particular immigration requirement?
Hon. Rosemary Vodrey (Minister of Culture, Heritage and Citizenship): I am on the record, as are members on this side of the House, recognizing and stating our concern to the federal government about anything which in fact may reduce immigration opportunities, particularly for people to Manitoba. As I have replied to his colleague from Point Douglas, I have also written to the federal minister on this issue stating Manitoba's difficulty with anything which causes possible reduction in immigration or in fact may cause family reunification to be delayed or stopped.
Mr. Conrad Santos (Broadway): Supplementary, Madam Speaker: what action will this minister, what effort would she be doing with respect to this new, second exclusionary immigration requirement of the federal government not to admit people who cannot currently speak English or French language?
Hon. Rosemary Vodrey (Minister of Culture, Heritage and Citizenship): I will say very clearly that our government does not support, in fact, we strongly reject two of the initiatives which have been recommended to the federal minister. That is the testing abroad for language, and also we are not supportive of the core language requirements. I have made an attempt to meet with the federal minister on this issue. She was unable to meet. A meeting had to be cancelled, in fact, when she was in Winnipeg recently, so I will be writing to her and also I will be attempting to meet with her shortly.
Mr. Santos: If the minister is to be logical and consistent, would she propose an all-party nonpartisan legislative resolution to denounce these requirements?
Mrs. Vodrey: As the member knows, it is my responsibility as minister to put forward the position; however, there may be some room for discussion. Particularly, I know that the member for Point Douglas (Mr. Hickes) and our government have shared a number of similar concerns, and I believe that there may be room to speak further on this particular issue.
Capture Deadline
Ms. Rosann Wowchuk (Swan River): Madam Speaker, once again, this government has decided to capture elk for domestication, and once again, there is controversy. Biologists across the country say that there should not be any capture after the end of February. However, here in Manitoba, the deadline for capture was set for March 8, then extended to March 10 and now is extended to March 12.
Will the minister ensure that the capture will end immediately and the date will not be pushed back again?
Hon. Glen Cummings (Minister of Natural Resources): Madam Speaker, the opposition of this member to establishment of the elk industry in Manitoba is well known. This is simply another attempt on her part to discredit what is a well-run and carefully managed industry.
Mr. Dave Chomiak (Kildonan): Madam Speaker, on a point of order. The minister is experienced enough in this Chamber to know that our rules do not allow ministers to impute motive. The member was asking a very legitimate question on behalf of constituents in Manitoba, and the minister has no right--the minister does not have to answer the question, but he has no right to impute motive, and in fact when the motive he tries to impute is terribly inaccurate and wrong.
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Madam Speaker: The honourable Minister of Natural Resources, on the same point of order.
Mr. Cummings: If I may, on the same point of order. I believe the newspaper clippings in Swan River will clearly demonstrate that this member is opposed to elk ranching.
Madam Speaker: Order, please. On the point of order raised by the honourable member for Kildonan, the honourable member had a point of order relative to our rules for the minister to respond to the question asked and not provoke debate.
Madam Speaker: The honourable Minister of Natural Resources, to quickly complete his response.
Mr. Cummings: Madam Speaker, two of the areas where capture is being undertaken are being shut down today, and one trap in the Interlake will be closed in two days.
Madam Speaker: Time for Oral Questions has expired.