Madam Speaker: I would like to draw the attention of all honourable members to the loge to my left, where we have this afternoon Mr. David Orlikow, the former member for St. Johns.
On behalf of all honourable members, I welcome you this afternoon.
Mr. Mervin Tweed (Turtle Mountain): Madam Speaker, it would appear that members opposite have had a tremendous change of heart when it comes to referendums. Lately, they have become proponents of referendums. The NDP seem to have forgotten that when they were in government, without referendum, without vote, they increased taxes through enhanced old taxes or new taxes 22 times in five years at the expense of all Manitobans.
Just last week the member for Thompson (Mr. Ashton) publicly advocated for the government to spend some $40 million on a referendum, money that would be better spent on health, education or family services, our government's priorities. His comments are in direct contrast to the member for St. Johns (Mr. Mackintosh) who during debate on balanced budget legislation criticized the idea of referendums as expensive. The member for St. James (Ms. Mihychuk) during the same debate questioned whether Manitobans could understand the complexity of referendum issues. The member went on to state, government needs to be flexible to look at the longer cycle, not to be held by the confines of legislation which do not allow duly elected representatives to do what is best for Manitobans.
The member for Brandon East (Mr. Leonard Evans) even went so far as to agree with a statement by the Premier (Mr. Filmon) that declared, "We are in office with a mandate to exercise our judgment and to make decisions on a whole range of issues under new and changing circumstances." This is exactly what the situation with Manitoba Telephone System is, new and changing circumstances. The member for Crescentwood (Mr. Sale) stated unequivocally, "We are not supportive of tax referenda." However, he appears to be in favour of referendums on the issues that offer his party the opportunity to grandstand at the expense of all Manitobans.
Madam Speaker, I, for one, am somewhat confused as to exactly what the NDP want, though I do suspect they are even more confused.
Ms. Becky Barrett (Wellington): Madam Speaker, Friday, November 8, 1996, was an historic day for the community of Weston and Cecil Rhodes School. An honour roll plaque, listing 753 former students of Cecil Rhodes School who served in the Second World War, was unveiled at a special Remembrance Day service. In 1995, the 50th anniversary of the end of World War II, Ron and Margaret Alexander, long-time Weston residents and Brian Crow of the Winnipeg School Division No. 1, looked for a plaque hung in 1942 honouring 338 students who were then serving in the Armed Forces. When their search proved fruitless, they, along with Legionnaires Roy Clark, Tom Crothers, Gordie Hamilton, Jessie Napper and Bill Nicol, decided to put up a new plaque. By mid-summer 1996 the list had doubled to 753 names.
Students in the industrial arts program at Tec Voc, under the direction of Len Spiller and Terry Pearson, made the new plaque, which was unveiled during a very moving ceremony at Cecil Rhodes School. I know all members of the Legislature will join me in congratulating Mr. Jim Duncan, principal of Cecil Rhodes, the students and staff who participated in the ceremony, the community members who attended and those through whose efforts the contributions of Cecil Rhodes students will never be forgotten.
Mr. David Newman (Riel): Yesterday I had the honour of attending the Indian and Metis Friendship Centre of Winnipeg's eighth annual veterans powwow. The honourable member for Rupertsland (Mr. Robinson) was the master of ceremonies. I was extremely touched by the impressive respect paid to the veterans by the people in attendance. Notably I would like to emphasize the role and numbers of the youth in attendance as one is not accustomed to seeing our young members of society in such abundance at these kinds of events.
The highlights of the day for me included two moving events. One was the friendship dance. This dance appropriately and powerfully symbolizes, with brilliant colours and an abundance of joy and fellowship, an approach to avoiding armed conflict in the future. The strong message of universal brotherhood and sisterhood was delivered to young and old alike in a warm and friendly manner.
The second very moving occurrence was the way in which respect was bestowed on the veterans. The veterans sat in the middle of the dance floor during a lull in the ceremonies and the hundreds of people present, one by one, came forward and shook their hands. The honourable member for Rupertsland appropriately stated that these veterans are warriors who have earned and deserved the respect of all.
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My participation in this event also gave me an opportunity to spend a moment with another honourable member, the honourable member for Point Douglas (Mr. Hickes), who generously explained to me several of the traditions in and around the ceremonies. The additional insight he shared was enriching for me in terms of culture and knowledge of the traditions and the significance of the day.
I would also like to thank Cindy Monkman [phonetic], the powwow co-ordinator, the Indian and Metis Friendship Centre, through its president, Nelson Sanderson, and all those who were involved in recognizing the sacrifices for freedom paid by these veterans. My participation in this event certainly served to enlighten and enrich my knowledge of the aboriginal culture and emphasized how different cultures learn and prosper by participation and sharing with the various groups that make up this great society. Thank you.
Mr. George Hickes (Point Douglas): I am proud to be able to put a few words about the formal recognition and remembrance that we participated in on November 8 and November 11, to thank all the veterans for their commitment and courage, on behalf of the citizens of Canada to the veterans, especially the aboriginal veterans.
Few Manitobans are aware of the full extent of the losses which were endured by aboriginal veterans and the difficult situations which many aboriginal veterans faced when they returned home to Canada. Unlike many of the soldiers they fought alongside, aboriginal soldiers were not always treated as heroes upon their return to Canada. After sacrificing years of their lives to fight for this country, aboriginal soldiers returned to Canada with nothing. Stripped of their aboriginal status after volunteering for the forces, many aboriginal veterans were unable to even return to their own communities following the war.
Without a chance to return to the life they had lived before going off to war, these same veterans remained unrecognized and unaccepted by the nonaboriginal community for years. Clearly, for aboriginal veterans their sacrifices did not end once they had returned to Canadian soil.
Madam Speaker, while nonaboriginal veterans were eligible for land grants provided by the Government of Canada after returning from the war, aboriginal veterans were never offered these same land grants. Many people are still unaware that in order to serve in the Canadian Forces, to serve their country, aboriginal soldiers were forced to give up their treaty status and their rights which went along with their status. In going off to war, aboriginal soldiers put more than their lives on the line. By giving up their status as aboriginals, they put their own cultural identity in jeopardy in order to serve their country.
In his presentation to the Senate committee, Sam Sinclair, the president of the National Aboriginal Veterans stated: I remember while in service we were treated as equals because one bullet can kill you as well as another person. Once we returned home, we were treated as nobodies again. People were denied jobs. We thought that some of us were equal and qualified for these jobs. We were denied at other levels involving land, education, health and responsibilities all the way down the line. Because people were not told exactly what their rights were as aboriginal veterans, they did not know what was available to them.
Since the earliest battles on the Plains of Abraham, aboriginal people have served in defence of our country, and I believe it is time that these veterans were afforded the recognition and respect which they deserve and hopefully will come in the near future. Thank you, Madam Speaker.
Mr. Kevin Lamoureux (Inkster): I just wanted to take this opportunity to express some concern on behalf of the Liberal members of the caucus with respect to Bill 67 and the selling off of Manitoba Telephone System.
We very much want to see an opportunity to be able to have some sort of debate or discussion on this particular piece of legislation and detect it in terms of denial of leave and are somewhat concerned in terms of the urgency in which the government is prepared to see this bill passed and the possibility of even going into closure because of the inability of different parties coming together and achieving an agreement, because we do have very strong thoughts that we would like to be able to express on the record with respect to this and are very concerned in terms of the direction.
I will get, hopefully, the opportunity to expand at great length as to why we have found ourselves sitting here today. I do believe in principle that there is a need for us to understand what has taken place over the last few days of this session, and I do plan to focus some of my attention on that once we do get to the debate on Bill 67, in hopes that we will get the opportunity to debate this very critical, important debate.
I look to both the opposition House leader and the government House leader in trying to come up with an agreement that would facilitate debate. No matter what their partisan positions might be with respect to what has happened in the past, we do believe there is a need for third reading debate and hopefully we will see that. Thank you, Madam Speaker.
Hon. Jim Ernst (Government House Leader): Madam Speaker, despite their huffing and puffing and political posturing, the members of the opposition obviously do not want to debate Bill 67 by denying leave today. Therefore, I move, seconded by the Minister of Environment (Mr. Cummings), that the House do now adjourn.
Some Honourable Members: Oh, oh.
Madam Speaker: Order, please. It has been moved by the honourable government House leader, seconded by the honourable Minister of Environment, that the House do now adjourn. Agreed?
Some Honourable Members: Agreed.
Madam Speaker: Agreed and so ordered.
Some Honourable Members: No.
Madam Speaker: No?
Madam Speaker: Order, please. There is a motion on the floor. The question was called. It is not debatable. All those in favour of the motion, please say yea.
Some Honourable Members: Yea.
Madam Speaker: All those opposed, please say nay.
Some Honourable Members: Nay.
Madam Speaker: In my opinion, the Yeas have it.
Mr. Steve Ashton (Thompson): Yeas and Nays, Madam Speaker.
Madam Speaker: A recorded vote has been requested. Call in the members.
The motion before the House is that this House do now adjourn. All those in favour of the motion, please rise.
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A RECORDED VOTE was taken, the result being as follows:
Cummings, Downey, Driedger, Dyck, Enns, Ernst, Findlay, Gilleshammer, Helwer, Laurendeau, McAlpine, McCrae, McIntosh, Mitchelson, Newman, Pallister, Penner, Pitura, Praznik, Radcliffe, Reimer, Render, Rocan, Sveinson, Toews, Tweed, Vodrey.
Ashton, Barrett, Cerilli, Chomiak, Dewar, Doer, Evans (Brandon East), Evans (Interlake), Friesen, Hickes, Jennissen, Lathlin, Mackintosh, Maloway, Martindale, McGifford, Mihychuk, Reid, Robinson, Sale, Santos, Struthers, Wowchuk.
Mr. Clerk (William Remnant): Yeas 27, Nays 23.
Madam Speaker: The motion is accordingly carried.
Mr. Kevin Lamoureux (Inkster): Madam Speaker, I had paired with the Premier (Mr. Filmon) in order that he may be at the funeral for a great Canadian, the former Premier of P.E.I., Joe Ghiz.
Mr. Gary Kowalski (The Maples): Madam Speaker, I was paired with the Minister of Rural Development (Mr. Derkach), who is on a very important trade mission to Ukraine.
Mr. Neil Gaudry (St. Boniface): I was paired with the Minister of Finance (Mr. Stefanson).
Madam Speaker: This House is adjourned and stands adjourned until 1:30 p.m. tomorrow (Wednesday).